Athena Options
«ADMIN» Athena says, "on the phone with wyld just a second or two"

Blindside nods.

You say "Anyone else joining us?"

Athena doesn't think so. I'll talk to you first though.
Blindside okays.

Blindside gets, then passes out, sodas.

Athena yawns. Sorry I was trying to get Wyld to be quiet lol.

Blindside nods.

Athena says "So I don't want to get into a fight.. I hate opening like this but you and I rarely agree. I was asked to DO SOMETHING by both sides and I thought about that.. I dreamed about it last night. And I came up with what I am going to do. I am giving two very clear and outlined options. I don't think you are going to like them and I am sorry for that."
Athena lays out the options.

You say "First… can I interject?"

Athena says "Sure"

You say "Just to sort of head this off at the pass."

You say "If this is about those buildings?"

You say "I'm not a part of that."

Athena says "Nothing to do with buildings"

Athena says "This is about the appeals"

You say "OKay. No problem. What -is- this about. I don't have any appeals in other than the voucher."

Athena says "About Ally and Johny's rep hits."

You say "I havn't appealed my rep hit. I do however, have a que in to track down the person trashing my name."

Athena says "Well that is what we are here to talk about."

Blindside nods. Okay. I wanted to make sure this conversation was necessary :)

Athena says "no no, it directly involves you."

Athena says "okay you ready?"

Blindside nods.

Option one is a very strict no contact non exsistance platform. This applies much less to you and Ally and more so for Cassie and Sheba. The option states that there shall be no contact what so ever between Cassie Sheba Ally and Johny. They no longer exsit in anyway shape or form. MORE SO. The subject is CLOSED. Staff is not to be contacted regarding the "watchers" from Cassie or Sheba unless it is to report that the "watchers" have made contact, a post regarding them as well as the other way around. If the watchers are somewhere and Cassie shows up she is to leave, not even go in. If she log on and is in the same place she is to remove herself in no longer than 60 seconds. The result of not obeying this statute by any player will be verified by the master log… there will be a karma dock of no less than 10 karma and not to exceed 30 karma a jail stay for no less than one week and not to exceed 30 days. The second offence will result in an automatic +nuke of the PC bit. And further abuse will result in a one year site ban. … no let me get to option 2. Which is more so where we are all headed anyway.

Blindside listens.

Option 2. We go stright into PVP. Each player involved gets ONE player to bring in that is not Cassie Sheba Johny or Ally. All people in this Sceen will be 100% consent on. Consent will not be passed on from this sceen. All consent dies with this sceen. No if ands or butts about it. The sceen will be ran by two trusted Admins that will not be me or Wyld. There will be no appeal option on this run. the players will be able to HOG. Consent dies with the HOG. There will be no fallout PERIOD. Once this sceen is over and judged if the players involved start bitching we will default to option 1 and will go straight to nuking. No bitching, no moaning, no crying on pub. Do it and I'll freaking nuke who ever does it. And before you say this is total bullshit… I am most likely going to lose my PC in this as well. So there it is.

I was asked to do something, and it is going to be done. To me the rules are outlinned as clear as day and through this it gives me with out a shadow of a doubt the backing to destroy who ever disobeys. This .. what I am sure is harsh is not directed as anger to you. But I need it to be understood that I am not playing games. I am done talking now.

You say "Neither of these options is acceptable to me. Both of them attempt to dictate the flow of the IC ramifications of the game. I will explain why.

On the first part: I cannot abide by 'no contact orders'. I did nothing wrong and I will not be excluded from -any- scene, them present or not, for something -I- did not do. That is unequivocally unfair to the injured party here, which is without reservation, 'my side'.

On the second part: This is an unacceptable action in that it seeks to immediately launch us in to a PVP kill or be killed situation I have not asked for nor endorsed; It seeks to dictate the TERMS and CONDITIONS of that PVP situation, which are unfavorable to the injured party, which again, on the basis of the IC and OOC attacks and the -outright cheating-, is again, us."

You say "Your options, while I appreciate them, do nothing but punish us and give 'them' what they want."

You say "Which is to 'ruin' our fun."

Athena sighs.

You say "I'm sorry to complicate the issue, Athena.""

Athena says "I told you that you wouldn't like it. But these are the options as they stand as I am not giving either party what they want at this point. Because neither party will ever agree on what is fair. And that has become more obvious than anyone can imagine lol."

You say "So tell me why. Tell me why, Athena, that you think these are the best solutions. Tell me why, when attacked, unfairly, OOCly, by irrational people, We, 'My side', must abide by either a life-and-death situation or be barred with pain of SITEBAN from a scene on the grid?"

You say "Because that, is a punishment to us, for -being good-."

You say "And we have been good."

Athena doesn't think that y'all are going to be the ones sitebanned. This is to protect all involved. It is being laid out how it is laid out so that the same rules apply to both sides. That there isn't a biased and the playing field is levels. Is this what I want, no not really. But both sides have demanded a solution and this is the only one I can come up with with out bending to the will of either side. This is my way of giving both sides a choice. I don't expect it to be easy or something either 100% wants not is it what I want. But I think we are past what people want and this stops things one way or another it puts and end to it.

You say "I would propose a third option."

Athena says "K"

Aladriel has arrived.

You say "Tell the people who abuse, who collude to harm other players, who engage in OOC attacks, who engage in cheating to hurt people, to shut the -fuck- up. Smack their asses and call it a day. Treat people like -adults- and show them your paddle or show them the door, but do not try this 'even handed' approach, because all you do is destroy my faith that staff can act to defend those who are attacked, and reinforce that us keeping our heads down and playing by the rules has been for -NO- good.""

You say "Thats option three.""

Aladriel says "Did you get the long, drawn out chat from earlier?"

Athena says "What chat?"

You say "Ally spent the morning trying to talk to Cassie."

Athena says "And?"

Aladriel sighs.

Aladriel says "It didn't go horribly, but it was incredibly frustrating it. I have it logged. She said she'd be emailing it to you."

Aladriel says "In short…………"

You say "For me, this comes down to trust, Athena. I trust you to run the game fairly. That involves making hard choices, but FAIR choices. And punishing us because of someone elses actions, is patently unfair. It undermines my trust that if I play nice, play by the rules, follow the dictates of staff, that I will be be able to play my game in peace and be supported."

You say "Because those two options leave me entirely unsupported. Either I have to fight and kill, maybe die, or I have to suddenly abrogate my game under pain of siteban."

Slinger has arrived.

You say "Thats the core of it."

Aladriel says "I was trying to tell her that on my end, nothing IC happened. And that she was saying that it was. And basically if she dropped the rep queue, there was really no problem: She did not have to "forget" any of the RP she did. She could still have her PC mad at Ally, but on Ally's side there is NO animosity towards Cassie the PC. Because there'd be no reason to. IF she goes through with it, she's rewriting my reality and there would be a problem."

Blindside shuts up to let Ally talk.

«OOC» Slinger says, "Heya."

«OOC» Slinger is mostly just listening, if that's okay.

Athena can pretty much write what Cassie said after that word for word.

Blindside is okay with it.

Aladriel says "She is utterly fixated on the fact that because I did not want to OOCly engage Sheba and her friends, of which she was one, that it translated to my PC ICly abandoning her PC. She has no regard to long and repeated explanation that I was not ICly ignoring her, but rather removing myself from dealing with the players behind the characters until our situation was resolved. She does not get that, really, and is convinced that I had wronged her."

Aladriel says "She was also very concerned with having to RETCON her play, and I asked her what she had done reactively to this, and she said that basically she trashed Ally verbally to Sheba, Hiro, and Sakura. I indicated to her that she could have done that and it was fine, that I considered her PC talking to her friends much different than Cassie telling anyone who would listen how bad Ally was, in an effort to damage her Shadow Reputation."

Athena Nods. Look Ally, I just laid out the two options I have to resolve this.

Blindside can repost them if you like.

Aladriel says "And I thought I was getting through to her in telling her that: Ally the PC is not mad at Cassie and has no reason to be. And if we did things the way I believed they should be done, Cassie could still be mad, not like Ally, but really there'd be no repercussions from it. The alternative *would* give Ally a reason to have issue with Cassie and it might not end well. She was willing to accept dropping the queue if I do some sort of public apology."

Athena is going to repost for you and then we will discuss. I need to think for a moment while you read anyway.

Athena says "And do you want to do a public apology?"

Slinger lifts a brow. She was? If so, that sounds like at least there's /some/ potential there.

Slinger says "In other words, it sounds like she's at least open to some kind of discussion."

Aladriel says "She is convinced that I've wronged her and there has to be some sort of comeuppance for me. She still believes I want her punished, even though I tried every way I could think of to show her that what I was asking for, Cassie would not be punished in any way, shape, or form, and it would also not be creating an atmosphere where she has to leave the room if I walk in and vice versa. Lemme pull quote."

You say "I want to re-iterate, the core of my issue, Athena, for you to ruminate on. At no point can I accept a solution that requires the assault victim, to use stark lines, to serve time with the assaulter, or to share in his punishment, for nothing more than -being assaulted-. To do so, removes from me the impetus to have FAITH in the staff that fairness will prevail. Frankly, if this goes forward, there is no justification for continued faith that behaving PROPERLY is the right way to get your 'way' in Denver, because what Sheba and Cassie want, is to wound us. And this, your solutions, both of them?""

You say "Do exactly what they want.""

Athena is going to wait on Aladriel

Slinger is open to other solutions, myself. If we can get one that both sides agree to and can abide by.

Aladriel says "I'm finding it. Honestly my core is, I want OOC OOC and IC IC."

You say "Slinger, the problem is, thats just not reasonable."

You say "If I hit you, and I then drag you to arbitration…"

You say "And I make you give something up for ME hitting you, for me to be 'okay'?""

You say "Fuck that."

You say "You have aggressors here. You have people who took the agression, and responded properly, by the rules, byt he book, taking their issues to staff."

You say "And I cannot, nor will I, abide by any decision that wounds me -again- for THIER actions."

You say "Thats fundamentally unfair.""

Cassie says, "Change it to Cassie has been extra critical for nothing. Again I will let things change and the Queue go away if you admit our spat orginaly started because of you taking out your frustrations on another player on me. I will openly admit I go a bit to angry over it and let it snowball end result we both look equaly bad. And we state we've settled it"

«OOC» Slinger says, "I hate to say it, but… um… Cassie's solution looks good to me? Admittedly, I don't know the situation involved, but if that's all it takes to settle it, it's not like she's asking for /that/ much, at least from where I sit. Not even asking you to admit full culpability, but just a relatively understandable thing…?"

Blindside has no problem with that solution; it doesn't involve me at all :)

Aladriel says "That came after more than an hour of talking, bringing her down from where she originally wanted everything to stand,……and this."

Aladriel says "Cassie says, "NOw I spoke my peace about things regarding you to Athena. You never touch my queues or anything and I'd be fine. You stay out of my way I stay out of yours. Because even in this we can't communicate because you've clearly not heard anything I have to say""

Aladriel says "I am considering that. Because I do not want PVP. Up until her queue, there was NO REASON for there to be PVP or for Johny the PC and Aladriel the PC to have any issue with Sheba or Cassie the PC."

You say "I have only RPed with Sheba once, and that was a scene in which she cheated. WHatever. I don't know the chick, I don't need to know the chick. I've -never- RPed with Cassie."

Athena says "So is that what you guys want?"

Slinger wants anything that makes people stop calling me names as my admin-alt ;)

Aladriel says "The OOC issues were enough to pretty much decide that we wouldn't go skipping into play with them. And I do not want to be forced into dragging an OOC issue into an IC one that is going to make a lot of people very unhappy."

Athena much prefers a resonable resolutions.

Aladriel sighs.

Aladriel says "I have one more thing to say."

Athena says "Yeah?"

You say "I don't care how it's settled between Ally and Cassie. Thats not my business. My business, is ensuring I am not harmed for someone elses agressive, abusive IC and OOC actions."

Aladriel says "What I really want, I have not gotten. What I wanted was for reasonable people to realize that nothing IC happened, because it wasn't played, and there are no grounds for any one else other than ME to tell me what my PC did, much less *punish* me for those things that I did not do. And that has not happened. So I am forced, now, to make a public apology to a demonstratedly and admittedly unbalanced player in order to appease her. The type of person who is not content that I apologized to her many times, but demands that I do that where she can raise a ruler and point to it for anyone who would listen."

Blindside exhales. "Yeah, that about sums it up. We must admit fault or accept punishment along side the bad actors, so they can point at us and say we got what we had coming. THat doesn't sit well."

Aladriel says "And I'm willing to do that because this is a mess, and the other ideas I'm hearing don't really fix it. And I just hope it gets noticed what I'm doing, and I hope that it puts an end to it. I'm a grown adult, I don't need someone else to say that I can't play with the people over there cause we can't play nice. I 'm happy to not play with them of my own accord. So I'll make a post. And if that does not do enough for them…. I'm sure they will be vocal about it. And if they are, I hope it'll be dealt with accordingly. Because I will have done whatever I could to appease them, and any future problems will *not* have been started by me."

Athena nods. "K.. I will speak to Cassie and Sheba on my end. If they give any of you any shit let me know.

You say "She's not on staff; SHe's not in my sphere of play; and provided she doesn't use staff as a weapon again? I don't forsee any issue. If I do find msyelf in an issue. I'll discuss it with staff. Like I did in the first place."

Aladriel says "Just stemming from my earlier conversation with her, I just want to clearly state this too, please. This is mostly IC."

Athena says "State what ever you want. I am listening"

Aladriel's IC reality:

Fact: All play with Sheba and the Magic Box group (Sheba, Cassie, Sakura, etc) stopped before Aladriel joined the Watchers. The last scene with Sheba took place on the day Aladriel gave birth.

Aladriel would have civily left the Magic Group because of her new daughter and because of new comittments. She did not tell any one of them that she had anything to do with a team called the Watchers. (Fact)

Aladriel has absolutely no idea that Cassie had anything to do with Daemon Starks, any affiliation or the like.

Cassie has no idea that Aladriel had anything to do with the Starks thing (as far as I know, stemming from that, no one besides Johny and Kassandra know she was even there).

Aladriel has no reason to be mad at Cassie the PC. She was never Cassie's biggest fan, but she had no reason to be *mad* at that PC. The biggest reason Cassie has to be mad at Ally, as far as I know and as far as we RPed, is because Aladriel left the magic group.

Athena nods. "Very much noted. And thank you.

Aladriel says "And with that reality, the only person who lost anything is Aladriel, who lost a magic group. Cassie and Sheba lost nothing and were not punished in any IC fashion for this."

You say "Also; neither of them have any knowledge that Johny had anything to do with Starks. I sloughed off the SAmuel Clemens identity and he's currently living in Rome."

Athena nods. I will handle both Cassie and Sheba from here on out.

Athena says "I appreciate the time you took speaking with her to try and resolve this"

You say "I'm not going to ask that they be punished."

«OOC» Slinger hugs Athena.

You say "THey should be, but I am not going to demand it."

You say "I just want to play my damn game."

«ADMIN» Athena is going to be emo and refuse hugs

«ADMIN» Athena laughs

«ADMIN» Athena wants everyone to just play the damn game

Blindside was!

You say "Which is kind of the entire basis of my objections ;)"

You say "Thanks for listening to us. I appreciate that; far more than simply presenting the options and saying: CHOOSE WISELY"

Athena says "I almost always listen unless people start cursing at me"

Aladriel says "Exactly. This most recent part started with Cassie throwing mud and we're ending it. I don't need Do Not Contact and Do Not Be In The Same Room with Them orders or anything. That'll work themselves out. I just want this chapter firmly closed and don't want to get trashed on the boards. Also…..one more thing."

Athena says "and that doesn't happen often if ever these days"

Athena says "how many one more things do you have woman? You steal Marry Popins Carpet Bag or what? :P"

Blindside laughs.

«OOC» Slinger says, "+return me when done? ;)"

Aladriel does work for Disney and the Broadway Mary Poppins IS in town….

«ADMIN» Athena says, "nope you are staying with me"

Aladriel is going to write her thing and post it, and if Cassie doesn't like it, I do not want to hear about it. Cause if she renegs on it, I'll happily let it go through and kill her and have that be that. =)

Athena wants cheap tickets to Disney World… hoook me up!

Aladriel closes her bag.

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